Melissa Mashburn 0:01
I actually talked to a woman in Canada and she's like, I don't like you. I didn't like reading it. I threw it across the room. I wanted to burn it and I'm like, okay, this is great. Thanks. And she's like, but then I kept going. And I was like, wait a minute, and then she said, I've read the whole book. And then I read it again and it is exactly what I needed and she said, it was so good and so timely, that after I read it, I gave it to my pastor, and he read it. And I was like, Oh, that is amazing.
Laura Howe 0:40
From Hope Made Strong. This is The Care Ministry Podcast, a show about equipping ministry leaders and transforming communities through care. Supporting those in your church and community not only changes individuals' lives, but it grows and strengthens the church.
But we want to do that without burning out. So listen in, as we learn about tools, strategies and resources that will equip your team and strengthen hope.
I'm Laura Howe, and welcome to The Care Ministry podcast. On the show today we're going to be talking about women in ministry leadership, with Melissa Mashburn. Now the other day, my 89-year-old grandma came over to have tea and came for a visit. She is so sweet, such a godly woman but yet so spunky at the same time, she was encouraging me and saying that she wasn't surprised that HopeMade strong is growing because as a child, I was always busy and pushing the limits. And once again, she shared stories that I've heard 1000 times. But of course, it's my grandma and I nod and I smile. And she was sharing how I was a very, let's say spirited child when I was young, constantly into things and pushing my family's buttons and boundaries to the limit.
And then I shared with her that as a young woman, I actually really struggled with thinking that leadership and having a strong voice was not for me as a Christian woman. In fact, I tried to suppress my personality and I tried to fit into that nice mold created for young Christian women in the 90s. And she just nodded and listened compassionately, when she shared that for most of her life. She thought that being quiet and introverted was a hindrance and a negative character trait. She said that she wished she was more outspoken and direct. But it wasn't until later in her life that God showed her that she too is valuable in design in such a unique and very intentional way that she can offer ministry and leadership as a quiet introvert.
And then she offered me encouragement that I too, was designed and created in a unique way with gifts and abilities to lead. We're all leaders quiet and bold, but that we should all do it unto the Lord, being willing to submit to His will, not letting fear nor pride get in the way. So good.. She's so wise.
And when speaking with many of you, I'm hearing similar stories that you kind of fell into care ministry and as a ministry leader, that many of you feel disqualified, or not suited for this work. And yet here you are leading and serving exactly how God designed you to be and Melissa Mashburn is all too familiar with this feeling as well. She was born in Kentucky, raised in South Florida, and now back in Kentucky again, and has been serving and leading in ministry for over 20 years. And her unique leadership journey began when she was a young adult new in her faith and feeling unqualified and out of place. Having not grown up in the church, Melissa gave her life to the Lord after she was married and pregnant with her first child, overwhelmed with the responsibility of it all. She cried out to God and has never looked back. The change in her life was major and she attributes her growth to mentors and the community that came alongside her.
Melissa Mashburn 4:28
You know, I think I've always had mentors in my life at different stages in seasons. I think even before I was a Christian. I come from a family of very strong women and so the women just my grandmother, the matriarch of the family. She ended up being a single mom of eight kids right after the depression her husband died and just watching her life working three jobs raising these kids having all these grandkids and everybody was always there and it never seemed like she lacked, she didn't lack anything and so she was a very key mentor in my life, my mom.
But I think spiritually it's funny because my mother-in-law, and I talked about this even in the book, my mother-in-law was the first person that gave me a Bible and this was before, I asked Jesus in my heart, especially for my 21st birthday, and I remember going, Why doesn't your mom like me like that? And no, I mean, you know, she's praying for her son's intended, and I get it now as a mom and somebody that's older. But as a young woman, I didn't understand and so I would just keep it out and so when they came over, it was out, and, but that's what God ended up using in that time while I'm newly married, and now I'm pregnant, and all of these things are happening. And so then I would open up the Bible and how it started reading it, and I would start asking my husband questions, and I'm like, what about this? What about that?
And he's like, You don't know that? And I'm like, no, I didn't grow up with this Bible. And his like where are you and I am like Genesis. Just learning all those things things and she planted that seed by giving me that Bible and so for a very long season, she was a mentor to me just by her walk in her faith in her obedience, and stuff like that and it's so crazy, because it was not a, it was a little bit of a bumpy start to our relationship, because I wasn't a believer. And now I'm leading her son, you know, down a horrible path, apparently. And so it was, it was not a wooo!! welcome to the family. It was like, oh, great, this is gonna be a mess and so we had a lot of friction.
And it's, it's so it's so crazy and awesome and amazing to see how God redeemed, that rough start and she is now and it's in the book. Also, she's now one of my biggest cheerleaders and encouragers and in the person that continues to push me forward in faith, like, you can do this God's got something big, keep going, keep going, like I'm so proud of you. I've seen it. And so she was a big, or is she still around.A big mentor in my life and then along the way, strategically investing in in relationships, which is, I talked about this about finding your community, strategically, investing in relationships that are going to be life-giving and encouraging and spurring me on. So I've always looked for some of those key people in my life.
Laura Howe 7:47
Yeah. It's so valuable, when we don't really necessarily understand the value that they're adding to us when we're young. Right? We don't see and I look back when I in my younger years, there was this couple that were so influential in my life, looking back, but in the moment, I just thought they were youth leaders. I just thought they were people that I babysat their kids and then they hung up out in jovial places. But I look back and think, wow, they were so intentional at finding space and opportunity. I remember doing random things like oh, they had to go to Walmart. So I would just go along with them. And now I think about it as a mom. And I'm like, Whoa, I had no like, they were busy people, but they always created space. And I never valued that when I was young but now I look back then I was like man, that was so key in in, in growing. Yeah.
Melissa Mashburn 8:42
Well, and even looking back down to see like, it doesn't have to be something monumental or complicated. It's come along come with let's go to Walmart or be a part or it's just inviting you in. It's not about this whole 12 Step discipleship program and all these other things. Those are important. I'm not negating that but I'm saying when it when it comes to mentoring people and pouring into them, it doesn't have to be complicated.
Laura Howe 9:09
Yeah, it's so good. Take the pressure off, right? If you're making dinner and have someone be chopping the veggies beside you, and that's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. So good. So good. I would love to hear your story of leadership and ministry. So if you are newly married, you know, just giving your heart to Jesus had a new baby. That's all a lot for a young person. So tell me where your ministry work started and what that journey was like?
Melissa Mashburn 9:37
Yeah, it is pretty. It's funny because at times you feel like it's totally random. But in hindsight, you know, it's totally God and there is no random and he orchestrates all things in such a beautifully complicated way that we could never do on our own. So, the fact that he chose me and called me to ministry, full-time professional ministry is, is it's laughable at times coming from where I've come from in my lack of experience at the time, but I was, it was in the late 1990s. So I'm totally putting that age on myself here. But it was. It was the late 1990s. And now as a young mom, I've got kids and I've got questions and I'm like, I'm going to church, I got it, you know, I'm going to do this.
And it was in that, that season of being a young mom, my kids are two years apart. So having, you know, two little preschoolers with me, dropping them off, and then just seeing the exasperated preschool workers or the preschool director, and she's like, Hey, you guys want to do this? And they're like, no, no. You know that was the first ask, and then it was, hey, you know, we could really use some help but it was a second ask but the third ask to serve.
Okay, we'll do this once a month and we can help out, it's how we can get back and that's actually how I got started, is just being around, well, then my husband and I would serve together in the three-year-olds, and actually to this day, and he's been professional ministry as well. So he's been an executive pastor, and a coach and all these things. And to this day, he still says that some of his funnest, and most fond memories were when we were serving in the three-year-old class together, because awesome, there's just so much joy, and just excitemen and it's simple. And so we started serving once a month and then, you know, I, God made me a leader wired me that way, it took me a long time to kind of own that.
But um, why are we doing this? Why are we? Why don't we do this? And what if we re-orchestrated the schedule that it made sense? And it you know, so then I'm doing all these things that are like, Hey, you want a job?
Laura Howe 11:59
So you worked yourself into a job...
Melissa Mashburn 12:02
I did, I walked myself into, but I just saw things that weren't working and I couldn't keep doing them some junky way. And so I'm like, hey, have you thought about they're like, hey, have you thought and that I mean, it? That's funny, but it was definitely more than that. But essentially, that's how I was asked to join the ministry team at this church in Fort Lauderdale and honestly, I, I didn't, I didn't really even know what I was signing up for at the time and I didn't understand the weight of the responsibility of the call of, of being on staff of what that meant, how that would affect every, every circle of my life. And not just in the moment, but long term. But God, two favorite words together. But God just said, do this and I did that and I didn't understand it. But I did it and that's kind of how it all began was just that willingness to, to go where I didn't know and didn't understand and it was a step of faith, honestly.
Laura Howe 13:18
Yeah. It was. And in that, in through ministry, there are so many challenges. There's so many highs and lows are so many self-discovery moments happen. Oh my goodness, oh, my
Melissa Mashburn 13:33
Oh, my goodness.
Laura Howe 13:35
It's so much because you're being challenged to go outside of your comfort zone, almost constantly relying on God every step of the way and you know, and challenged. Okay, who am I? And what do I believe and, and where is this going is all kind of just this walk of faith that can be really, really tricky. Did you experience that?
Melissa Mashburn 14:03
Huh, 1,000%? Honestly, everything you said I'm like, yep, yep, yep did that did that. It is it's messy and it's complicated. You're dealing with people and people at their highest of highs and their lowest of lows. And honestly, you're also dealing with yourself and figuring yourself out. And again, I would say I'm in my 20s at this point and I've got two little kids over there little older at this. By the time I actually went on staff, they were nine and seven so they weren't they were still little to me but they weren't little little like preschool any longer. And you're still figuring out how to be a mom how to be a wife and now how to be a ministry leader and it it honestly, it's one of the reasons I wrote the book is because I learned the hard way everything. Everything In the book is everything I learned the hard way because it was not having a good understanding of who I was not having a good understanding of who I was in Christ not having a good understanding of the balance of ministry and family. And then at that time also my husband was called into ministry, and he became a pastor so then I became a pastor's wife and I was definitely not prepared for that and the layer of complication that was added on my shoulder because of that, so it yeah, it's, it's it's messy and complicated in honestly, if if you don't have a good understanding of who you are in Christ, and you're not solidly stuck in in it with him. I don't want to say it'll mess you up, it'll, it'll certainly wreck you.
Laura Howe 15:52
Yeah. Break it down. Yeah. Well,
Melissa Mashburn 15:56
Yeah it will, several times over. That's me.
Laura Howe 15:59
And I that's the that's the faithfulness of God is that yeah, it will break you down. But God, yeah, those two words by God, but that's not the end. You know, for people who are listening and may feel in this moment that they are broken down that the complexities and the disappointments and the frustrations or even resentments that can creep in when you're serving and caring and supporting and, and your life is, you know, into other in other people's like, in meshed with other people I should say, then it could feel like it breaks you down but that doesn't have to be the end certainly is not the end, for sure.
Melissa Mashburn 16:37
It never is and I think that's what the beauty is, it just feels like it at the time. I It feels like it's the end, it feels like there's no hope it feels like a note in your head you like you know, that, you know, if it is hope. But your heart and I have talked about this a lot lately, the head and the heart, I know they're only 12 inches apart, but your head knows but your heart is like, hurt and broken and sad. And so there's this disconnect in the language between the two at the time and I can remember very vividly a season where I felt like I was in I felt like I was in the prime of my ministry career. Things were moving. I was I had climbed from preschool director at this point. Now I'm on like the senior leadership team, the directional leadership, I'm part of the decision-making team. I'm doing membership classes on teaching. I'm on I'm on stage. I'm in charge of like beach baptisms, and all of these things like I'm where it's taking me a while to get to that point but I made it I was also ordained, not ordained let me take the back I was licensed as a pastor at that church at the time and it was an SBC church. So Southern Baptist Church 20 years ago. That's a big deal. So that's a big deal. It's why I clarify that was not ordained. I was licensed at this church. And so I felt like I was kind of at the prime of Whoo, I've worked so hard. And here I am and like it, you see where this is going? Right? Like, there's fogg coming so I'm I like doing all the things I'm running in my lane, things are awesome. And God took it all all the way and that ministry opportunity disappeared for me and my husband, so our whole livelihood, and devastating, devastating and talk about revenue and trying to figure things out and sitting there with it.
And I remember, I sat on my back porch one day and I had I had that big Bible that my mother in law gave me like I have a teacher. The very same one. I have a teaching Bible that I carry and take with me everywhere. It's got all my notes, but that Bible is one of the giant Life Application Study Bible. Yes, it's big and meaty and heavy and now I can appreciate that it was expensive and a nice gift. And I was sitting out on the back porch with that and I'm crying out to God and I'm like, This doesn't make any sense. Like we were rolling l and things were great. We were in the zone, and just literally crying and I just remember you ever have those moments where you can you can feel him you can just feel his presence and and a wind came. I'm on a covered back porch. I'm not like out in the wind. I'm on a covered screened in patio with blinds down, there's no wind where I'm at, okay, and a wind came and blew the pages of my Bible. I'm not I wish this was a story legit like this literally happened to me and it went to a verse. I don't even remember the verse. This is how I was so like, the hairs on my arm stood up and I just started to cry. And I you know, I read whatever it opened up to and I just remember thinking here I was this big, beautiful bush with all these birds and I was flourishing and doing all these things and now I am literally a stick in the mud. And it's dirty and it's gross and you wonder it, will it come back to life again, and I'm questioning my call, I'm questioning my call to ministry, I'm questioning all those things. I didn't question God. I just was like, Oh, I don't know if I want to do this anymore. What is my place in all of this?
And right! But, but then moving forward past that, seeing that that was a pruning season, to make me better, stronger, healthier, and more prepared for the next season of ministry. But in that moment, it was just isolated and lonely because on top of it, on top of all the other things, we lost all of our friends and stuff from it, so it but God use that again, but God use that in that season to to I call these kinds of seasons, cocooning where you kind of close off all the other things, and you just really lean in to what's important, and it was time to take care of your family time to take care of yourself time to take care of your your walk. And so I just cocooned and leaned into my own spiritual develop my own quiet time, my own family and, and I think that's what he used to prepare me for the next ministry call.
Laura Howe 21:21
It's beautiful and hindsight, it you can see that but in that moment, you're wrecked. You're broken. You know, who am I? What am I? Is this all a waste? Did I do something to cause this? You're questioning all the things? Of course, you know, like you said, you're not questioning God or sovereignty or his goodness, but it's like, what the heck? Where did this come from?
Melissa Mashburn 21:45
What are you doing? Yeah.
Laura Howe 21:47
Okay. And now what?
Melissa Mashburn 21:49
Can I get an Express Pass out of?
Laura Howe 21:52
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Wow, God is. It's amazing that in those moments, when you reframe and be like, Okay, then I'm just gonna do what's in front of me, I'm just gonna take care of me. I'm gonna take care of my family, to take care of my relationship with God, I love those three things that you just focus in on, but it's not all lost. Those are the three things. Yeah, yeah, it's good. So where did God take you from there? What's the end of the story? Your moment
Melissa Mashburn 22:26
Of the river and through the woods, me back into ministry at another local church in the area. And it's funny, because as soon as I was, quote, unquote, off the market from this other church, I did get a few other churches reached out to me and I was like, no, no, no, I just need time and he gave me that time and, and then an opportunity. So that church was a big mega-church. And we were, we were running about 14,000. It was an international multiple campuses and stuff like that. Then he called me to a church plant and we were running about 90, and it was different. It was totally different. And they they asked me to do kids again, and I was like, nope, not doing that ever. You saw her with the other place. I don't feel that and then oh man, God wrecked me again.
And he's like,Well, you know, there's things that you can do. And that's where he really laid on my heart. A for now ministry and not a forever ministry, so I can come in and do something. For now that doesn't mean that that's my forever ministry, I love kids ministry, I don't have anything against kids ministry, I think there are people that are specifically wired and created who love it, live it, breathe it, and oozz it. And those are the ones that should be leading it. I am a fixer. So I can come in and I can take what's broken, and build systems and structure and strategy and volunteer teams, and then pick my replacement and get out of the way. And so that's where he really taught me to do to lean into this idea of a for now ministry. I'm calling you to this for now. They need you, I need you. Let's go to work. And so that's what I did.
Laura Howe 24:09
So beautiful. That's so cool. That's amazing.
Melissa Mashburn 24:14
And humbling. Superduper humbling. Because I didn't mention, you know, the other church I was at I had been licensed as a pastor and was being called pastor at this church, who also same denomination. In the past, I was like, No, we're not gonna we're not gonna recognize that. So on top of not a demotion but like after everything that I've been through, it felt like a demotion and then I had the title taken away. And that's really, that's really why in that in the book I talked about, you're more than just the title you have I lived it. I know, I wore it as a badge of honor. And God had to really kind of shave those things off of me and really, are you a pastor. Okay, that's great. What are you more and had to help me get back to my identity in him? And not the titles that man gave me because they're always going to be fleeting.
Laura Howe 25:24
Yeah. Well, we've hinted at it a few times, but I want to dig into what this book is all about. For contacts, you and I have met on Facebook, we've been Facebook friends, because you host a group called Ministry Check on Facebook. It is such a lovely group to be a part of, I just want to thank you so much for leaving that. Well. I'm very grateful for that. Where did that start? Because I know that was kind of the precursor to your book, which we definitely will get into. But Ken, where did the Facebook group come from? And, and? And how are you seeing that grow?
Melissa Mashburn 2:45
Well, the Facebook group actually came from Katie Cole. So Katie Cole had written a book called Developing Female leaders several years ago, and had a launch group with the book and basically the launch group, she realized that there was this need for this community. Yeah, so it, that's how it was created. And then, so at the time, I think it was running about 3,400 women.
Laura Howe 26:30
I was gonna say it's grown significantly and ten I joined I didn't know who Katie cool was. So I joined you are leading it.
Melissa Mashburn 3:22
That's sweet. Yeah. So she started it as part of this thing and then I was at a conference in Chicago, and I got a phone call and it was Katie and we knew each other online, and we had talked, you know, we know a lot of the same people fighting, give him my phone number. So I didn't even know like, I'm sitting in this training in Chicago at a very prominent church. And I'm like, I need to go take this phone call. So I excuse from the training and I was like, hello? Then got the talkin and she just said, you know, this group needs a pastor shepherd, and your name just keeps coming to my mind and God's laid it on my heart. And I really think it's you, would you be interested, and I said, I chuckled honestly, because I literally had just had, I was now at a church in the Orlando area and I had just had a conversation with one of the executive pastors saying, I feel this call back to women's ministry, but I was director of weekend experience and communications and all of those things, and they were like, I don't know how you're going to add that. Like, how I don't know how you're gonna, and I'm like, well, leaders lead and we just get stuff done. If you want to get stuff done you ask a busy woman and we're gonna get it done. They said no, and I was heartbroken and it was two weeks later that Katie called and was like, this group needs a Pastor Shepherd, and I think it too, and I so I chuckled, because it was like, Okay, God, I didn't see that coming. Like, yeah. Yeah, I knew you were planting this desire back on my heart, but I didn't see that comment. And so when I first took over the group, it was basically to just help help kind of create this community. And so that's really what I laid into.
And then along the way, you know, Katie and I, we've become really, really good friend, she is one of the people that I trust and know and love that can can speak the truth into my life in a way that sometimes makes you go Ohh!! She is so amazing. Yes, she is absolutely amazing. And so through the process, basically, she's handed off the group to me, I'm now in charge of this amazing community, a couple of years ago have called Ministry Chick, it's a private Facebook community. And so now we're running in about 3400, women from all over the world, who are coming in to get the resources and connections they need to thrive as a female leader in the church. So that kind of happened. And so that was years ago, over the over the process. And so through that, honestly, I sat down to write a completely different book, I sat down to write a book that I have taught on I've spoke on, it's been on my, it's been on my heart for like 10 years. And it was all about these girlfriends, and godly girlfriends, and how important it is and I have all these different types of friends that you should have, and, and all of these things, and I kept hitting a wall with it, and I couldn't get anywhere.
And so in a conversation with Katie, we had, we had a speak the truth and love moment, and she's like, you are zeroed in on one thing, and I think he wants you to pull up some and pull up and look at this whole thing. And when I pulled up and I started looking, and I was like, wait a minute, these are all and then I started kind of mapping out the things that I struggled with and where I was where I had learned along the way. And then I was like, wait, this is a little bit my story and a little bit field guide and it kind of hit on all the things. And then it turned into a conversation where she's like, You are Ministry Chick so it it needs to be called. I was like, I think it needs to be goes no, it definitely needs to be called. And I had already had the tagline and everything. And so it turned into Ministry Chick, Find your community, Own your leadership and Take your step.
Laura Howe 30:42
Oh, my goodness is it is a phenomenal resource. Let me tell you, Oh, it is fantastic and I'm excited to bring you on not only because you are lovely and wise and have a lot of things, but it's diverse. There's a Facebook group where people can connect with other people you offer like webinars and training and tools like the it's a, it's a valuable group, then you have this book, which I love that you call it a field guide. Because it's I can get overwhelmed with books I read for pleasure and for like, I just like to get away. And so to read something that's nonfiction, I can get overwhelmed with having to read a whole book. But I love how you describe it as a field guide where every chapter you can like, jump around in the book and find what you need. And get into that. And then you also have coaching. So for those who are needing more. So I want to hear about all three but let's, let's focus in on the group for a moment. I mean, that group, let's focus in on the book for a moment and describe kind of what it is you say matches your story. But what what is the book all about?
Melissa Mashburn 31:58
The book, I call it a field guide. I when I first was pitching the book and talking to people about I said, remember those What to Expect When You're Expecting books? Yes. We had them I lived by them, I would like something was babies crying, I can't figure it out, where do I go? And I said, this is a What to Expect When you're a woman and you're in ministry and so that's kind of how I wrote it is in the field guide popping into places where you need it at that moment, and it's not a one and done like you read it and you're done. My hope is it's a book that you constantly go back to, because of the resources that that's in it.
And I set up strategically in two ways. The whole first section is you're more than just and it's what I wish I knew when I started out in the ministry in is you're more than just the title that you have the skills you bring in being the token female, you know, the only female at the table, the person you're married to be married struggle with the married in the ministry, the people that you're raising, being a mom in the ministry and so on top of that, so that's the whole first section. Then there's section two because I'm a big fan of I want to talk about the problems and let's get real and but I want to offer real practical solutions on on things you can do to move forward.
Like I don't want to identify a pain point and then be like good luck. I wanted to give you real practical solutions. So the back half of the book also, so they're in each chapter, but the back half of the book, section two is you were made for more how to move forward in your leadership development. And that's where it's time to find your community on your leadership. Take your step, and then where do you go from here. And then on top of all of that, along the way, I have real ministry chick experience stories from women that are in the ministry that are doing the work, some very well respected, love people, you know them, most people know that some of these people are, and they shared stories, they shared stories of their experience, things that they bumped up from each of the chapters. And then, which is great, because I didn't want it to be just me, I didn't want it to be just my story. Because if this is going to be a field guide for women in ministry, then it's got to be it's got to fit all women in a ministry. And I'm gonna sidebar for a second in that was even in the decision of the design of the book was strategic in in the way that it wasn't super, super girly and it wasn't super, super strong, but it is strong, and it is feminine.
But then also I have diversity in the women, that I have different women at different ages and stages and different ethnicities and backgrounds and they're holding hands, I really, really wanted them to be united and working together. So that was also important for me.
Laura Howe 34:51
So that so what has been the feedback so far? Where have you seen people picking this up? Because I can see how I would use as I'm still in the stage where that first part is your identity. I think that's an ongoing conversation in my, in my life, and I think in people's lives and I'm curious to hear what are some of the stories that you've heard back from people in whether it's your group or from the book.
Melissa Mashburn 35:18
It's, I think the most, there's been some amazing, amazing stories or people I actually talked to a woman in Canada, and she's like, I don't like you. I didn't like reading it. I threw it across the room. I wanted to burn it and I'm like, Okay, this is great. Thanks. And she's like, then I kept going, and I was like, wait a minute and then she said, I read the whole book and then I read it again and it was exactly what I needed.
And she said it was so good and so timely, that after I read it, I gave it to my pastor, and he read it. And I was like, oh, that is amazing and so hearing, hearing that it rubbed it rubbed a little bit. It just it's not. It's not a and I can be a rah rah though Jesus Fun, fun. It is. But it's not light and fluffy. I am encouraging and I can be funny. And we'll just some of the things that I do are just ridiculous. So I'm not afraid to laugh at myself. But I want you to learn from my mistakes but then seeing that people are starting to do it with their teams and haven't got churches contacting me now that are wanting to take their teams do it. I've got a I've had, I've had men reach out and they're leading women on their teams and they're like, I'm gonna read this book. And it is a checkbook, I mean, it says ministry chick and then to know that men are reading it and that they are learning and wanting to learn and wanting to grow in how they communicate. And just in the awareness of what the female leaders on their staff are struggling with, or deal with. is beautiful, and incredible and humbling so, so humbling.
Laura Howe 37:15
I love that people are seen, they're validated. They see themselves in your story, but they're also equipped and you're you're giving people next steps you're giving people okay, how, you know, like you said, those practical hit the ground, you know, tools that people are taking this on to learn as a community like their leadership. That's incredible. I love that. That's really, really exciting.
Melissa Mashburn 37:40
And I forgot to mention this when we were talking a little bit ago, but not only are those real ministry check experience stories in there. So there's 14 of those. There are 65 other women who have contributed, and they're in there called chick chat. And so these little chick chats are practical tips from women that are in the ministry all over the world from the Ministry Chich group. So on each section, there's some chat tips that's hard to say fast in each one that are like, here's what I do, here's what I do. Have you thought about this, or this has really helped and those were like gold for me, because I was like, that's so good, because I didn't think about that. And here now it's another layer of resourcing at your hand. That's why I think it's a field guide that you can kind of go back to what do I do about this? Or how can I get my kids involved? Or how can I? How can I balance being the only woman at the table? And it's just that good? That good? I don't think I'm gonna say my words are that good. I'm saying what the women that are sharing. Yeah, the collective of us. We're better together working together in collaboration and not competition is remarkable.
Laura Howe 35:58
Oh, it and it's refreshing. I think it's a unique approach and that's where I'm moving in care ministry is okay, how can collective, how can we together, support and build each other so that we can support and build the kingdom? And I think it's just a beautiful and refreshing way to approach ministry and I love that you are offering that for women in leadership and women in ministry, it is absolutely incredible. If people wanted to connect with you, if they're curious about the group and want to read the book, we're gonna have all those links on the show notes. And then people, you also have coaching, is that correct?
Melissa Mashburn 39:36
Yes, yes. So I'm mostly focused on women in ministry, it's obviously my thing. It's, I tell people, there's, there's three things I love, I love Jesus, my family and Disney, sometimes they're in different orders. But we're gonna have, I like to have fun but like I said, I like to have practical solutions and so I want to come alongside women in ministry that are stuck with it are struggling, they're really kind of wrestling with either their leadership development or transitions are how to handle certain situations, and making the action plan because we have places to go like, No, we don't need to be stuck where we are, we can we can move forward. And that's really that whole part of the the last bullet point on the book was take your staff, it's like, let's go because we need, we need strong female leaders doing what God called and create them to do in health and wholeness, in the church, in the community, in the nonprofit world, in in wherever God has them.
Laura Howe 40:38
It's beautiful. I'm all I'm all in there. So when you look back, and you think about, okay, where you came from, as you know, a young, young woman, new family, just discovering Jesus and, and this early path into ministry and, and look back at, you know, what the questions you had, or the struggles that you had in the identity, okay, where are you God? And am I equipped? Am I the right person for this? If you can go back and send yourself a voicemail, or an email? What would you what would you say to your previous self?
Melissa Mashburn 41:18
This is a good question.I think I would go back and tell myself you are who he created you to be, and be okay with that and stop trying to be everything to everybody that season as a pastor's wife kind of really messed with me a little bit. And then as I get it done, girl, I went straight to work on let's fix all the things. And if you're in ministry, and you're listening, you know, you can't fix all the things, and you're never gonna get everything done on your list and so there's always going to be this to do list and so I just kept driving and pushing and driving and pushing and it's not healthy.
And so I think I would go back and tell myself, you are who God created you to be. And you're more than enough. First. I would also tell myself, to start counseling a lot sooner than I did. I talk about it in the book, I say the three people that you want on your side are coaches, counselors and comrades, the women in the trenches with you. That's another whole thing. I definitely would do that. And, and, and to make sure that I'm rooted and grounded in Him and not in my to do list.
Laura Howe 42:35
So good. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom, your resources. And I hope people join the group and get that book because it's phenomenal.
Melissa Mashburn 42:45
Thank you, friend. Thanks for having me.
Laura Howe 42:48
Hey, thanks for listening being a woman in ministry can be really challenging and it doesn't seem to matter if you grew up in church like myself, or started as an adult, like Melissa. But it also can be incredibly, incredibly rewarding. God created you with unique gifts and perspectives and it's time to lead in or as my grandma would say, use your gifts unto the Lord without fear or pride. You're definitely going to want to check out Melissa's book and perhaps even join The Ministry Cheek Facebook group. If you're in there, make sure you tag me say hi, I'm there too. All links and resources are in the show notes at hopemadestrong.org/episode80 And if you want to be reminded when an episode goes live, make sure you follow thanks for connecting, take care.
